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	<title>Comments on: The Hazards of Bicycling in Santa Clarita</title>
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	<link>http://scvtalk.com/2010/06/04/the-hazards-of-bicycling-in-santa-clarita/</link>
	<description>a blog for SCV nerds by SCV nerds. Blogging Santa Clarita daily since 2006</description>
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		<title>By: SCVTalk.com &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Humbling the Haves because there are many Have Nots</title>
		<link>http://scvtalk.com/2010/06/04/the-hazards-of-bicycling-in-santa-clarita/comment-page-1/#comment-18841</link>
		<dc:creator>SCVTalk.com &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Humbling the Haves because there are many Have Nots</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 10 Jun 2010 18:00:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://scvtalk.com/?p=4242#comment-18841</guid>
		<description>[...] was talking with another cyclist yesterday about my recent post on &#8220;Frank&#8221; the man who got hit by a car on Rye Canyon Road. This particular cyclist [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] was talking with another cyclist yesterday about my recent post on &#8220;Frank&#8221; the man who got hit by a car on Rye Canyon Road. This particular cyclist [...]</p>
<p> <img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" onmouseover="this.width=this.width*1.3" onmouseout="this.width=this.width/1.2" id="up-18841" src="http://scvtalk.com/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/1_14_up.png" alt="Thumb up" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('18841', 'add', 'scvtalk.com/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '1_14_');" title="Thumb up" /> <span id="karma-18841-up" style="font-size:12px; color:#009933;">0</span>&nbsp;<img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" onmouseover="this.width=this.width*1.3" onmouseout="this.width=this.width/1.2" id="down-18841" src="http://scvtalk.com/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/1_14_down.png" alt="Thumb down" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('18841', 'subtract', 'scvtalk.com/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '1_14_')" title="Thumb down" /> <span id="karma-18841-down" style="font-size:12px; color:#990033;">0</span></p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Bill Reynolds</title>
		<link>http://scvtalk.com/2010/06/04/the-hazards-of-bicycling-in-santa-clarita/comment-page-1/#comment-18691</link>
		<dc:creator>Bill Reynolds</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 08 Jun 2010 00:56:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://scvtalk.com/?p=4242#comment-18691</guid>
		<description>Just curious, Did Frank get his new tee shirt yet that reads:
&quot;One Less Bike&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Just curious, Did Frank get his new tee shirt yet that reads:<br />
&#8220;One Less Bike&#8221;</p>
<p> <img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" onmouseover="this.width=this.width*1.3" onmouseout="this.width=this.width/1.2" id="up-18691" src="http://scvtalk.com/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/1_14_up.png" alt="Thumb up" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('18691', 'add', 'scvtalk.com/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '1_14_');" title="Thumb up" /> <span id="karma-18691-up" style="font-size:12px; color:#009933;">0</span>&nbsp;<img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" onmouseover="this.width=this.width*1.3" onmouseout="this.width=this.width/1.2" id="down-18691" src="http://scvtalk.com/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/1_14_down.png" alt="Thumb down" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('18691', 'subtract', 'scvtalk.com/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '1_14_')" title="Thumb down" /> <span id="karma-18691-down" style="font-size:12px; color:#990033;">0</span></p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Bill Reynolds</title>
		<link>http://scvtalk.com/2010/06/04/the-hazards-of-bicycling-in-santa-clarita/comment-page-1/#comment-18600</link>
		<dc:creator>Bill Reynolds</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 06 Jun 2010 20:06:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://scvtalk.com/?p=4242#comment-18600</guid>
		<description>Great idea and this should apply to kids diving into shallow pools.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Great idea and this should apply to kids diving into shallow pools.</p>
<p> <img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" onmouseover="this.width=this.width*1.3" onmouseout="this.width=this.width/1.2" id="up-18600" src="http://scvtalk.com/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/1_14_up.png" alt="Thumb up" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('18600', 'add', 'scvtalk.com/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '1_14_');" title="Thumb up" /> <span id="karma-18600-up" style="font-size:12px; color:#009933;">0</span>&nbsp;<img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" onmouseover="this.width=this.width*1.3" onmouseout="this.width=this.width/1.2" id="down-18600" src="http://scvtalk.com/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/1_14_down.png" alt="Thumb down" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('18600', 'subtract', 'scvtalk.com/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '1_14_')" title="Thumb down" /> <span id="karma-18600-down" style="font-size:12px; color:#990033;">0</span></p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Fred Butler</title>
		<link>http://scvtalk.com/2010/06/04/the-hazards-of-bicycling-in-santa-clarita/comment-page-1/#comment-18564</link>
		<dc:creator>Fred Butler</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 05 Jun 2010 21:58:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://scvtalk.com/?p=4242#comment-18564</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;I know this sounds counter-intuitive… as in ‘if they are riding bikes why are they riding the bus?’ but it would help move riding bikes from a recreational focus to a transport focus&lt;/i&gt;.

I also ride the bus.  I love it, in spite of the surly teenagers.  But I ride when the temp is just too hot for me, say for example 95 plus.  It just kills me.  Plus, I take the bus when it rains or is too cold.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>I know this sounds counter-intuitive… as in ‘if they are riding bikes why are they riding the bus?’ but it would help move riding bikes from a recreational focus to a transport focus</i>.</p>
<p>I also ride the bus.  I love it, in spite of the surly teenagers.  But I ride when the temp is just too hot for me, say for example 95 plus.  It just kills me.  Plus, I take the bus when it rains or is too cold.</p>
<p> <img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" onmouseover="this.width=this.width*1.3" onmouseout="this.width=this.width/1.2" id="up-18564" src="http://scvtalk.com/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/1_14_up.png" alt="Thumb up" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('18564', 'add', 'scvtalk.com/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '1_14_');" title="Thumb up" /> <span id="karma-18564-up" style="font-size:12px; color:#009933;">0</span>&nbsp;<img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" onmouseover="this.width=this.width*1.3" onmouseout="this.width=this.width/1.2" id="down-18564" src="http://scvtalk.com/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/1_14_down.png" alt="Thumb down" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('18564', 'subtract', 'scvtalk.com/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '1_14_')" title="Thumb down" /> <span id="karma-18564-down" style="font-size:12px; color:#990033;">0</span></p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Toadly</title>
		<link>http://scvtalk.com/2010/06/04/the-hazards-of-bicycling-in-santa-clarita/comment-page-1/#comment-18548</link>
		<dc:creator>Toadly</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 05 Jun 2010 19:52:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://scvtalk.com/?p=4242#comment-18548</guid>
		<description>If the city really wanted to get cars off the road and increase bike ridership, they would allow free bus rides for bicycle riders (up to the bus carrier maximum). 

I know this sounds counter-intuitive... as in &#039;if they are riding bikes why are they riding the bus?&#039; but it would help move riding bikes from a recreational focus to a transport focus.

It actually wouldn&#039;t cost anything more than it costs now... those buses run whether anyone is on them or not.

If the bike/bus transport mode  catches on, I am sure someone will develop some kind of bicycle trailer for municipal buses.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If the city really wanted to get cars off the road and increase bike ridership, they would allow free bus rides for bicycle riders (up to the bus carrier maximum). </p>
<p>I know this sounds counter-intuitive&#8230; as in &#8216;if they are riding bikes why are they riding the bus?&#8217; but it would help move riding bikes from a recreational focus to a transport focus.</p>
<p>It actually wouldn&#8217;t cost anything more than it costs now&#8230; those buses run whether anyone is on them or not.</p>
<p>If the bike/bus transport mode  catches on, I am sure someone will develop some kind of bicycle trailer for municipal buses.</p>
<p> <img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" onmouseover="this.width=this.width*1.3" onmouseout="this.width=this.width/1.2" id="up-18548" src="http://scvtalk.com/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/1_14_up.png" alt="Thumb up" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('18548', 'add', 'scvtalk.com/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '1_14_');" title="Thumb up" /> <span id="karma-18548-up" style="font-size:12px; color:#009933;">0</span>&nbsp;<img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" onmouseover="this.width=this.width*1.3" onmouseout="this.width=this.width/1.2" id="down-18548" src="http://scvtalk.com/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/1_14_down.png" alt="Thumb down" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('18548', 'subtract', 'scvtalk.com/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '1_14_')" title="Thumb down" /> <span id="karma-18548-down" style="font-size:12px; color:#990033;">0</span></p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: SCVTalk.com &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Cars &#62; Everything Else ?</title>
		<link>http://scvtalk.com/2010/06/04/the-hazards-of-bicycling-in-santa-clarita/comment-page-1/#comment-18540</link>
		<dc:creator>SCVTalk.com &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Cars &#62; Everything Else ?</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 05 Jun 2010 17:36:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://scvtalk.com/?p=4242#comment-18540</guid>
		<description>[...] an exchange on posted on Jeff&#8217;s recent follow up to the Rye Canyon cyclist injury, reader Fred Butler shared the following:   Striped lanes would [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] an exchange on posted on Jeff&#8217;s recent follow up to the Rye Canyon cyclist injury, reader Fred Butler shared the following:   Striped lanes would [...]</p>
<p> <img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" onmouseover="this.width=this.width*1.3" onmouseout="this.width=this.width/1.2" id="up-18540" src="http://scvtalk.com/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/1_14_up.png" alt="Thumb up" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('18540', 'add', 'scvtalk.com/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '1_14_');" title="Thumb up" /> <span id="karma-18540-up" style="font-size:12px; color:#009933;">0</span>&nbsp;<img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" onmouseover="this.width=this.width*1.3" onmouseout="this.width=this.width/1.2" id="down-18540" src="http://scvtalk.com/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/1_14_down.png" alt="Thumb down" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('18540', 'subtract', 'scvtalk.com/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '1_14_')" title="Thumb down" /> <span id="karma-18540-down" style="font-size:12px; color:#990033;">0</span></p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Fred Butler</title>
		<link>http://scvtalk.com/2010/06/04/the-hazards-of-bicycling-in-santa-clarita/comment-page-1/#comment-18537</link>
		<dc:creator>Fred Butler</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 05 Jun 2010 16:55:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://scvtalk.com/?p=4242#comment-18537</guid>
		<description>Ridership for daily transportation needs? Maybe for a few extra folks.  Striped lanes would be a workable solution just as long as it doesn&#039;t hinder the flow of car traffic which should have precedent.  Bouquet Canyon north of Newhall Ranch is a good example.  An entire lane of traffic could easily be added for cars, but it is marked for bikers, who I rarely, if ever see using it.  Maybe on Saturdays or in the evenings. 

Like I stated, I am with you to a degree because I bike a lot, but I am just facing the reality of things.  Cars are not going away as the primary means of daily transportation for people and biking will never replace them as a viable alternative.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ridership for daily transportation needs? Maybe for a few extra folks.  Striped lanes would be a workable solution just as long as it doesn&#8217;t hinder the flow of car traffic which should have precedent.  Bouquet Canyon north of Newhall Ranch is a good example.  An entire lane of traffic could easily be added for cars, but it is marked for bikers, who I rarely, if ever see using it.  Maybe on Saturdays or in the evenings. </p>
<p>Like I stated, I am with you to a degree because I bike a lot, but I am just facing the reality of things.  Cars are not going away as the primary means of daily transportation for people and biking will never replace them as a viable alternative.</p>
<p> <img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" onmouseover="this.width=this.width*1.3" onmouseout="this.width=this.width/1.2" id="up-18537" src="http://scvtalk.com/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/1_14_up.png" alt="Thumb up" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('18537', 'add', 'scvtalk.com/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '1_14_');" title="Thumb up" /> <span id="karma-18537-up" style="font-size:12px; color:#009933;">0</span>&nbsp;<img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" onmouseover="this.width=this.width*1.3" onmouseout="this.width=this.width/1.2" id="down-18537" src="http://scvtalk.com/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/1_14_down.png" alt="Thumb down" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('18537', 'subtract', 'scvtalk.com/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '1_14_')" title="Thumb down" /> <span id="karma-18537-down" style="font-size:12px; color:#990033;">0</span></p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Fred Butler</title>
		<link>http://scvtalk.com/2010/06/04/the-hazards-of-bicycling-in-santa-clarita/comment-page-1/#comment-18535</link>
		<dc:creator>Fred Butler</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 05 Jun 2010 15:17:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://scvtalk.com/?p=4242#comment-18535</guid>
		<description>I ride a bike to work and back probably about 3 times a week. From CC to North Valencia, (or maybe we could say &quot;south Castaic&quot;). Roughly 13 miles one way. I have invested in some of the riding gear, as well as &quot;tripping out&quot; my bike in order to convert its original use as a mountain bike to being more for urban riding. I love the paseo system and it demonstrates one area of competence for our city planners.  

My ride takes me through the industrial center where a good portion of my ride keeps me on the main streets.  That has to do with limited road lanes for biking and no paseos going in the direction I need to go.  

Biking on a regular basis has made me more aware of bikers when I drive my car.  It certainly has made me aware of cars when I bike.  I never trust drivers, period.  I expect them to be uncaring of me being present on my bike and I just assume they are annoyed with me being in their way, so I ride defensively all the time when I am in traffic. 

HSAT, you guys just need to face reality that biking will always remain a recreational activity.  The majority populace, and that is a good 99% of the people easily, will always perceive biking as a recreational activity.  This perception will never change.  

The facts of the matter remain: biking to work or for work or to run chores is impractical and unworkable for people. The primary reason I bike is because we have only one car. I also need the exercise and my  wife needs the car much more than I do.  

I am blessed to have a shower at work and a locker to keep my stuff stored.  Pretty much all work places don&#039;t have such facilities.  People do not want to spend doing a 45 minute bike ride, getting sweaty, and then not being able to shower, and then work all day.  People don&#039;t want to hassle with having to bike to TJs or Whole Foods, shop, and then having to lug their stuff home in some basket-baby buggy contraption.  If the weather is unfavorable to being out biking, that compounds the problem.  

So, as much as I feel your pain to some degree, biking is never going to be seen as an alternative means of transportation for the regular person.  It is always going to be seen as recreational.  Even at those meetings you mention, the mind-set will be helping the city accommodate a growing number of enthusiasts, not providing alternatives for genuine transportation needs.  And if you insist on &quot;forcing&quot; the 99% of the world to &quot;accept&quot; your perspective by taking away a lane of traffic where the lane is much more needed for cars than a minuscule group who rarely use it, people will hate you.  They&#039;ll hate you with the visceral hatred those parents at the Summit swimming pool hate those few petty grumblers who don&#039;t like kids.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I ride a bike to work and back probably about 3 times a week. From CC to North Valencia, (or maybe we could say &#8220;south Castaic&#8221;). Roughly 13 miles one way. I have invested in some of the riding gear, as well as &#8220;tripping out&#8221; my bike in order to convert its original use as a mountain bike to being more for urban riding. I love the paseo system and it demonstrates one area of competence for our city planners.  </p>
<p>My ride takes me through the industrial center where a good portion of my ride keeps me on the main streets.  That has to do with limited road lanes for biking and no paseos going in the direction I need to go.  </p>
<p>Biking on a regular basis has made me more aware of bikers when I drive my car.  It certainly has made me aware of cars when I bike.  I never trust drivers, period.  I expect them to be uncaring of me being present on my bike and I just assume they are annoyed with me being in their way, so I ride defensively all the time when I am in traffic. </p>
<p>HSAT, you guys just need to face reality that biking will always remain a recreational activity.  The majority populace, and that is a good 99% of the people easily, will always perceive biking as a recreational activity.  This perception will never change.  </p>
<p>The facts of the matter remain: biking to work or for work or to run chores is impractical and unworkable for people. The primary reason I bike is because we have only one car. I also need the exercise and my  wife needs the car much more than I do.  </p>
<p>I am blessed to have a shower at work and a locker to keep my stuff stored.  Pretty much all work places don&#8217;t have such facilities.  People do not want to spend doing a 45 minute bike ride, getting sweaty, and then not being able to shower, and then work all day.  People don&#8217;t want to hassle with having to bike to TJs or Whole Foods, shop, and then having to lug their stuff home in some basket-baby buggy contraption.  If the weather is unfavorable to being out biking, that compounds the problem.  </p>
<p>So, as much as I feel your pain to some degree, biking is never going to be seen as an alternative means of transportation for the regular person.  It is always going to be seen as recreational.  Even at those meetings you mention, the mind-set will be helping the city accommodate a growing number of enthusiasts, not providing alternatives for genuine transportation needs.  And if you insist on &#8220;forcing&#8221; the 99% of the world to &#8220;accept&#8221; your perspective by taking away a lane of traffic where the lane is much more needed for cars than a minuscule group who rarely use it, people will hate you.  They&#8217;ll hate you with the visceral hatred those parents at the Summit swimming pool hate those few petty grumblers who don&#8217;t like kids.</p>
<p> <img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" onmouseover="this.width=this.width*1.3" onmouseout="this.width=this.width/1.2" id="up-18535" src="http://scvtalk.com/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/1_14_up.png" alt="Thumb up" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('18535', 'add', 'scvtalk.com/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '1_14_');" title="Thumb up" /> <span id="karma-18535-up" style="font-size:12px; color:#009933;">0</span>&nbsp;<img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" onmouseover="this.width=this.width*1.3" onmouseout="this.width=this.width/1.2" id="down-18535" src="http://scvtalk.com/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/1_14_down.png" alt="Thumb down" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('18535', 'subtract', 'scvtalk.com/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '1_14_')" title="Thumb down" /> <span id="karma-18535-down" style="font-size:12px; color:#990033;">0</span></p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: alan</title>
		<link>http://scvtalk.com/2010/06/04/the-hazards-of-bicycling-in-santa-clarita/comment-page-1/#comment-18534</link>
		<dc:creator>alan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 05 Jun 2010 14:34:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://scvtalk.com/?p=4242#comment-18534</guid>
		<description>We need to make sure that everyone wears a good fitting helmet, I see so many people without helmets, and now more and more kids are not wearing them. Please parents set an example and wear those helmets, they could save yrou life or your kids life</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>We need to make sure that everyone wears a good fitting helmet, I see so many people without helmets, and now more and more kids are not wearing them. Please parents set an example and wear those helmets, they could save yrou life or your kids life</p>
<p> <img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" onmouseover="this.width=this.width*1.3" onmouseout="this.width=this.width/1.2" id="up-18534" src="http://scvtalk.com/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/1_14_up.png" alt="Thumb up" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('18534', 'add', 'scvtalk.com/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '1_14_');" title="Thumb up" /> <span id="karma-18534-up" style="font-size:12px; color:#009933;">0</span>&nbsp;<img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" onmouseover="this.width=this.width*1.3" onmouseout="this.width=this.width/1.2" id="down-18534" src="http://scvtalk.com/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/1_14_down.png" alt="Thumb down" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('18534', 'subtract', 'scvtalk.com/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '1_14_')" title="Thumb down" /> <span id="karma-18534-down" style="font-size:12px; color:#990033;">0</span></p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Jim Farley</title>
		<link>http://scvtalk.com/2010/06/04/the-hazards-of-bicycling-in-santa-clarita/comment-page-1/#comment-18520</link>
		<dc:creator>Jim Farley</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 05 Jun 2010 00:44:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://scvtalk.com/?p=4242#comment-18520</guid>
		<description>Thank God Frank was not seriously hurt. Having recently returned to bike riding my rides are 90% recreational so I enjoy the trails to avoid the cars to the extent possible. Last weekend when I used the bike for errands I went South on Seco Canyon. it was terrifying to be in the narrow right lane with the cars approaching from behind. As Jeff says, Southbound Bouquet was no better. I preferred to get up on the sidewalk. To avoid the Southbound traffic.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thank God Frank was not seriously hurt. Having recently returned to bike riding my rides are 90% recreational so I enjoy the trails to avoid the cars to the extent possible. Last weekend when I used the bike for errands I went South on Seco Canyon. it was terrifying to be in the narrow right lane with the cars approaching from behind. As Jeff says, Southbound Bouquet was no better. I preferred to get up on the sidewalk. To avoid the Southbound traffic.</p>
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